Using LIDAR DEM for Real Courses

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morvio100
Posts: 92
Joined: Wed Apr 06, 2022 10:02 am

Re: Using LIDAR DEM for Real Courses

Post by morvio100 »

Don't be discouraged by the data being a little outdated or whatever Linkster(you've in-avertedly shot yourself in the foot with choosing a username like "Linkster" = you have alot to live up to now...lol..only joking), there will always be regular updates to even relatively new Lidar....the detail is impressive...just make a start and run with what you have accomplished so far..they rest/real-course specialist/designers will jump on board if you need help...best of luck with it.... :clapping:
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sagevanni
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Location: Somewhere on flat earth

Re: Using LIDAR DEM for Real Courses

Post by sagevanni »

Hi linkster,

I take back my earlier comment about sticking to my old ways. I'd really love to try your method.............

It might help other designers if you could put together a tutorial that is easy to follow and step by step.

Sage.............. :smile:
If there is one thing ................ummmmmmmm.......I can't remember.
Ian Wells
Posts: 351
Joined: Tue Aug 27, 2019 2:02 am

Re: Using LIDAR DEM for Real Courses

Post by Ian Wells »

Linkster,
It might help other designers if you could put together a tutorial that is easy to follow and step by step.
I’ll second that request from Sage, with the addition of a “very easy”.

Thank you.
Ian
hopeless@golf
Posts: 19
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2019 9:51 pm
Location: Stoney Creek, Ontario, Canada

Re: Using LIDAR DEM for Real Courses

Post by hopeless@golf »

I'll 3rd that request for the tutorial :cheers1:
linkster
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2022 12:12 am

Re: Using LIDAR DEM for Real Courses

Post by linkster »

Thanks for the interest! :smile:

I propose this to get us started; pick a real course you want to do, check the websites I mentioned earlier to see if LIDAR data is available, pick a grid density you want to work with and I will do your first course terrain for you. I am trying to get an alpha version of The Old Course at St Andrews ready for The Open but I will gladly get you started on a course. I will write a tutorial for generating green contours in QGIS and importing a course terrain after The Open wraps up.

PM me your requests.
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sagevanni
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Location: Somewhere on flat earth

Re: Using LIDAR DEM for Real Courses

Post by sagevanni »

How do we pick a grid density and exactly where do we go to get it.....????? What site......?????

You have a PM..... :smile:

Sage...... :cheers1:
If there is one thing ................ummmmmmmm.......I can't remember.
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Adelade
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Re: Using LIDAR DEM for Real Courses

Post by Adelade »

Sage, check the links in his previous post in this thread: viewtopic.php?p=14652#p14652

I tried it for some courses just to check availability. I uh... sort of think I figured it out (on the US site, Im guessing you're supposed to select "Elevation Source Data (3DEP) - Lidar, IfSAR" then "Lidar Point Cloud (LPC)" then "LAS,LAZ", then scroll to your desired location on the map and choose an area with for example the "Extend" tool, then hit "Search Products"). I got a few results for some courses on three of the sites, but I have no idea how to figure out whether its the sparse 10m data or the better 1m or 0.5m or whichever density. Perhaps one cant tell until importing it into whichever utility in the next stage?

As for picking grid density, I assume he means your desired distance between verts. The CRZ he uploaded for The Country Club was 2 meters for example.
Finished main APCD Projects: Amedal (own design), Nine Bridges (real course). Joint effort: Kauri Cliffs HD. Updates: Whirlpool, Royal Lytham, Royal St George's, Chicago, Chambers Bay
Working on: 2 fictional courses + Austin CC + a couple things...
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sagevanni
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Location: Somewhere on flat earth

Re: Using LIDAR DEM for Real Courses

Post by sagevanni »

Thanks Adelade,

I did..............I could spend a lot of time with trial and error to figure things out, but since Linkster has already done that I would very much appreciate a detailed tutorial class on paper to really make things go smooth.......LOL...!!!!

We will see what the "lidar man" can come up with....... :smile:

Sage...... :cheers1:
If there is one thing ................ummmmmmmm.......I can't remember.
linkster
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2022 12:12 am

Re: Using LIDAR DEM for Real Courses

Post by linkster »

For the USGS data site I gave a link for, search for a town near a course you are interested in in the upper right corner. Once you get the map centered roughly where the course is, go to the left side bar and select Elevation Products (3DEP). Select the 1m DEM data, and select All file formats. You can click Show Availability and the site will darken the areas of the map that have the data coverage. Click on Search Products and then links to available data and their coverage will show up. GeoTiff files are the most common and will be about 200MB each. It is hard to give instructions on how to use websites as each jurisdiction using a different setup, but I find the USGS site the easiest to navigate so far.

When you have the data downloaded it can be added to a GIS program layer for viewing. You can draw a polygon or lines in Google Earth for the course, export as a .kml file, and also view in a GIS program. There is a learning curve to using GIS programs and data but it's not as bad as getting acquainted with the APCD :smile:

The grid density I was referring to is what you want to work with in the APCD. The Country Club earlier was 2m but I will concede to more experienced course designers that that density is very hard to work with. I am working with a 3m grid for St Andrews and it is going well. Maybe a 5m grid in APCD is a good mix of ease of working with yet capturing terrain detail.
Ian Wells
Posts: 351
Joined: Tue Aug 27, 2019 2:02 am

Re: Using LIDAR DEM for Real Courses

Post by Ian Wells »

Linkster has provided me with the .crz file for the Mountain Top and Lake Club, NC with the LIDAR data, and I can only say WOW!.

It is APCD, but not as we know it.

I had looked at this course many times (designer Mr Fazio) but the Google Earth was not 3D, so I kept putting it off. Now with the elevation details provided by LIDAR (via Linkster), that excuse has been negated.

Linkster, thank you for the file. :tiphat:

Ian
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