Identifying new longer tees as the back tees

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Ian Wells
Posts: 602
Joined: August 27th, 2019, 3:02 am

Identifying new longer tees as the back tees

Post by Ian Wells »

On Gozzer Ranch I made tee V (red tee) the longest length, with tees I thru IV the same as the real course, as designed by Tom Fazio.

Migolfer has asked if it is possible to make the longest tee, tee V, the back tee? I do not know how to to do this as when I tried I was limited in APCD to a maximum length, which is shorter than I needed.
Anybody have a solution or ideas?

Ian
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Adelade
Posts: 1383
Joined: August 27th, 2019, 10:24 am

Re: Identifying new longer tees as the back tees

Post by Adelade »

I dont understand, are you saying you couldnt plant the Back tees at the spots where the Ladies tees ended up - but the Ladies tees were fine to plant there? If so, that sounds a bit odd (but could happen if you moved the define hole path points between planting the Ladies tees and now), the upper limit of Back and Ladies tees should be the same (but the lower limit is different).

Anyhow, there should be a way. You wont be able to get the scorecard in Links to show yardages outside certain limits, but you can make holes play however long or short you want. For example:

Tees1.jpg
Tees1.jpg (304.69 KiB) Viewed 434 times
Tees2.jpg
Tees2.jpg (392.85 KiB) Viewed 434 times

First of all, when you defined the hole path, within advanced settings, hopefully you used the "Create hole boundary shape for existing terrain" option, because then the limits are a little more generous. You can always delete and re-define hole paths if you are ok with having to replant pins and tees.

What it comes down to in order to evade the yardage limits, is to temporary move certain points of the defined hole path (or all at once) to a spot which will allow you to plant the pins or tees while you're planting them, and then move the defined hole path back afterwards. This applies to both pin and tee planting. So if you're working on a hole that is "too long" for APCD, you define the hole path as best you can within the limits, then make sure the red boundary shape for the hole is large enough to allow you to move the hole path points around. Then you might move all the hole path points towards the green so that the "center of green" point is beyond the green, then plant all your pins and make sure they're in the right places. Then move all points of the hole path towards tee so that the "center of tee" point is where you want the longest tee, then plant that furthest tee. Then, if no other tees are beyond the limit, and if you want the scorecard yardages for the other tees as correct as possible, you can move the hole path so that the middle points and the center of green are sitting correctly while planting the rest of the tees. When you finish the course, I think it is most important to have the middle points in the right places, because these have an effect on how computer players play the holes. I dont know if computer players get influenced by where the center of green point is (or if they ignore it and just play based on where the pin is), but it might have some effect on them, so it is best to have the center of green at least sort of correct if possible. The center of tee point shouldnt have an effect on anything so it is fine to leave that one wherever.

I think you can do it the other way around too, tees first and pins last.

The scorecard in Links will always show what the distance was at the time of planting the tees:
1. From the planted tee,
2. To and through all the middle points of the defined hole path (in the case of par 4 and par 5 holes)
3. and then to the center of green point.

However, personally I would argue against changing the tees on Gozzer Ranch. I understand that it would be more logical for Back tees to be the furthest, but here is how I see it: Most players play the Back tees without making research on how they are arranged, and I believe most players would like to play Gozzer Ranch closest to how the real life scorecard shows it, and that is what the Back tees currently represent. I think "fictional" tees that are placed further back than that are wonderful to have as an option, but if you make them the Back tees, most players are going to be using them without realizing it is further than the real life scorecard. Meanwhile, we already have a sizeable amount of courses for Links where Ladies tees are the furthest ones, so people who look for the extra challenge should already be on the lookout for them. Likewise, if there are any players who use Ladies tees because they want the shortest tees, they should also be used to keeping an eye out for it. Bottom line - according to how I see it - is that the Back tees should be seen as the "standard" tees that the designer intends for most people to experience the course through.
Finished Courses - Main: Amedal (fictional), Nine Bridges (real)
Other: Austin, Sheshan, Kauri Cliffs, Le Golf Nat. Updates: Whirlpool, Royal Lytham, Royal St George's, Chicago, Chambers Bay, Munchen Nord E
Working on: 2 fictional courses + a couple things...
Ian Wells
Posts: 602
Joined: August 27th, 2019, 3:02 am

Re: Identifying new longer tees as the back tees

Post by Ian Wells »

Thanks Adelade.

I did a test on what you explained and you are 100% correct with the procedure you explained.

migolf, I am sorry but I am leaving the course as it is. Perhaps if I start a new course where I add tees, I will make them the back tee?

Ian
migolfer
Posts: 208
Joined: October 21st, 2020, 2:40 pm
Location: Northern Michigan

Re: Identifying new longer tees as the back tees

Post by migolfer »

Ian Wells wrote: June 21st, 2024, 10:35 am
migolfer, I am sorry but I am leaving the course as it is. Perhaps if I start a new course where I add tees, I will make them the back tee?
Adelade wrote: June 21st, 2024, 7:25 am
I understand that it would be more logical for Back tees to be the furthest, but here is how I see it: Most players play the Back tees without making research on how they are arranged, and I believe most players would like to play Gozzer Ranch closest to how the real life scorecard shows it, and that is what the Back tees currently represent. I think "fictional" tees that are placed further back than that are wonderful to have as an option, but if you make them the Back tees, most players are going to be using them without realizing it is further than the real life scorecard. Meanwhile, we already have a sizeable amount of courses for Links where Ladies tees are the furthest ones, so people who look for the extra challenge should already be on the lookout for them
Thank you both for your thoughts regarding the placement of these custom longest tees. The logic for doing it the way I've seen it on this course and others is irrefutable. I will just have to make a note of which courses have these and reference those when I choose to play any course in Links.
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