Chambers Bay Update - Beta Available Here

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Adelade
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Joined: August 27th, 2019, 10:24 am

Chambers Bay Update - Beta Available Here

Post by Adelade »

I've been working on an update of Sage's Chambers Bay course, I consider it fully finished, but Im making a Beta version available here just in case (Im not uploading the beta to the official course list, but the download link can be found at the bottom of this message). Im planning on uploading the final version on January 2nd, so anyone who wants to beta test has until then to get back to me.

The original version was worked on by Sage and Sean Landry and released in June 2020. I thought it seemed like it might be a really nice course and very much looked forward to play a full round on it, but on at least one green, I couldnt find any pin that I considered realistic or enjoyable on the green speeds I enjoy using. So I never actually played the course, and instead made a note to one day ask Sage if I could make an update with modified greens and pins.

So thats mostly what this update is all about - I spent a lot of time on the green elevations, so I believe they are fairly accurate to real life. I also reworked various elevations immediately around the greens, plus some fairways and dunes to be a bit more authentic and/or links-like. Secondly, I added a fifth set of tees to play slightly longer than the Back tees (Back tees are 7164 yds, Ladies are 7512 yds - par is 72), I placed them where I personally felt like they would be most fun to play in Links (where tee areas where available, anyway), so I highly recommend playing the course from the Ladies tees unless you like relaxing rounds (the course has some really large fairways and many really tall elevated tees, so it plays easy for its yardage - at least unless you use windy). I also made the 2D grasses play more consistent/predictable, they dampen the ball slightly (but not that much), so it is wise to be careful and consider laying up safe if you end up in the rough (just as one often would, in real-life linksland rough). Either way, you're usually kind of unlikely to hit the grasses on the way up since they are so thin. There are plenty other less significant changes, a full list of them can be found in the .txt file included in the download link.

The course is a real linksland course in Washington state at the coast of Puget Bay, which is an extension of the Pacific Ocean. It is a really rather spectacular layout with extremely dramatic dunes and elevations, along with gigantic bunker complexes. It was famously used for the 2015 US Open where most people hated it because of the green surfaces being too young and in very poor condition, making putting a bumpy lottery. The bad reputation earned from then doesnt take away that it is one of the most spectacular layouts you could find around the world, and I think it plays wonderfully in Links, as long as you dont use too easy settings or conditions.

Since the course loads so slowly in APCD, this time more than any other, I do not promise to change suggested or observed things. But that doesnt mean I don't want to hear all suggestions, so any observations and feedback you can think of is, as always, very welcome.

Thank you so much Sage, for making the course (I frankly have no idea how he managed to have enough patience to create all those huge and complex bunkers - very impressive!), for letting me freely update it, and for helping me with one part of the update :smile:

Download link: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/aapxesztzvch ... j6k2a?dl=0
Finished Courses - Main: Amedal (fictional), Nine Bridges (real)
Other: Austin, Sheshan, Kauri Cliffs, Le Golf Nat. Updates: Whirlpool, Royal Lytham, Royal St George's, Chicago, Chambers Bay, Munchen Nord E
Working on: 2 fictional courses + a couple things...
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Adelade
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Re: Chambers Bay Update - Beta Available Here

Post by Adelade »

TL;DR: Hesitating over whether the Ladies tees are still too easy or not. Looking for opinions to help me decide whether to bother making a tournament version or not (I dont want to, but it depends heavily on what people think).

I want to address one more thing. I've been somewhat back and forth over whether to maybe, just mayyybe make a separate tournament version as well... I feel like the course still plays fairly easy from the new Ladies tees... There are a lot of tee areas that would enable the course to play even further, and there are actually four holes that can play as either par 4 or par 5 (and have even been used both ways in real life), so there is a lot of potential for different setups. However, there would be a lot of complications and annoyances about making a tournament version (I could literally write several pages about all my thoughts about it ... but I'll try to make it shorter), which makes me hope that everyone will be content with these Ladies tees. That being said, I would very much like to hear opinions about it. If several people would highly appreciate a tournament version, then I would be much more motivated, and would at least strongly consider it.

First of all, all the tees except for Ladies ones represent well how the course plays on ordinary days for ordinary members, and I didnt want to ruin that, so course par has to stay 72 for the main version. Secondly, the course file is an absolute monster to work with in APCD. Everything loads really slowly, and each time I make any kind of save, it requires over 3 minutes of loading before I can continue with anything. And there is the constant fear of APCD crashing unless regularly saving, especially with courses that load slowly... It is painful. I honestly really dont want to make a second version unless it feels necessary or if there are several people who would appreciate it a lot. (Also, sidenote - if I make a tournament version, I would have to edit hole previews again in order for them to not be completely wrong... something I really wouldnt look forward to, but I dont think I'd be comfortable not doing it, so I know I would end up doing it anyway...)

So I've been trying hard to make the Ladies tees the best possible compensation instead. I have pondered a lot over which holes I could potentially make even longer, and I can only arrive at the conclusion that I already have them at the spots I think are best / most fun. Many holes, even when having so many tee areas available, lack them in the spots where I ideally would want them, and I just dont feel like building new tee areas or moving them. I also want the Ladies tees to function well with Windy as well, since I think this course is exceptionally well suited for that condition, considering the setting, large fairways, and the fact that hole lengths clearly are designed with the most common wind direction in mind. The only thing I'd like to change really, is turning hole 1 into a par 4. 4th could perhaps swap to par 4 as well, but that would require a slightly shorter yardage for it to be reasonable, and while that would make it harder to score in relation to par, it would actually make it easier to score under 60 or 70 for example... 13th could perhaps be turned into a 3-shot par 5 by using the tees further back, but I feel like the hole plays more fun as a tough par 4... So am I gonna make a tournament version just for the sake of those few changes? Sure, I could replant all the tees then, which would probably also enable some brutal tees that could be fun for people who use the pro distance mod, and overall just more options for pro play tees, so that would certainly be a bonus, but Im not sure how much people care, or whether anyone does at all. So... with all that in mind, if you would like to see a tournament version, I would love to hear about it.
Finished Courses - Main: Amedal (fictional), Nine Bridges (real)
Other: Austin, Sheshan, Kauri Cliffs, Le Golf Nat. Updates: Whirlpool, Royal Lytham, Royal St George's, Chicago, Chambers Bay, Munchen Nord E
Working on: 2 fictional courses + a couple things...
braden1308
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Joined: August 29th, 2019, 2:02 pm

Re: Chambers Bay Update - Beta Available Here

Post by braden1308 »

Adelade

If you are interested I have the green contours for Chambers Bay. I could make some tga's and send them to you, that's if you would be interested.

Glenn
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chad
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Re: Chambers Bay Update - Beta Available Here

Post by chad »

It would be great if an upgraded ocean texture and pano were added to the next version, if possible :thumbup:
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Adelade
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Re: Chambers Bay Update - Beta Available Here

Post by Adelade »

braden1308 wrote: December 18th, 2021, 2:28 pmIf you are interested I have the green contours for Chambers Bay. I could make some tga's and send them to you, that's if you would be interested.
Aw man this happened with Royal St George's too! Sorry, I'll have to pass since I already spent a lot of time on the greens and am happy with how they turned out, I appreciate the offer though. Let me know if you have anything for Austin Country Club? :thumbup:
chad wrote: December 18th, 2021, 6:03 pm It would be great if an upgraded ocean texture and pano were added to the next version, if possible :thumbup:
Chad, your screenshot is from the 2020 version, not the 2021 Beta. See my notes about the panorama in the .txt file.
Finished Courses - Main: Amedal (fictional), Nine Bridges (real)
Other: Austin, Sheshan, Kauri Cliffs, Le Golf Nat. Updates: Whirlpool, Royal Lytham, Royal St George's, Chicago, Chambers Bay, Munchen Nord E
Working on: 2 fictional courses + a couple things...
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chad
Posts: 188
Joined: August 27th, 2019, 2:18 pm

Re: Chambers Bay Update - Beta Available Here

Post by chad »

Nice list of improvements...the ocean texture looks great. :thumbup:
Maybe throw a few boats out in the Bay? Other than that, looks sharp.
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Jimbo
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Location: Victoria-but a Raven at heart!

Re: Chambers Bay Update - Beta Available Here

Post by Jimbo »

Don't forget the train tracks!😀
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guitarget2019
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Re: Chambers Bay Update - Beta Available Here

Post by guitarget2019 »

It was called "Puget Sound" when I lived in Port Orchard. :whistle:

Absolutely loved Sage's version, and I bet I'm going to love this one too. Of course, I almost always play with the highest wind and fastest/hardest greens The Mod allows, so it's never a gimme course. :thumbup:

D.W.

P.S. Thanks to all for their efforts! :cheers1:
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Adelade
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Joined: August 27th, 2019, 10:24 am

Re: Chambers Bay Update - Beta Available Here

Post by Adelade »

I've had no beta testers get back to me (except for the one comment above about the ocean texture and boats) so Im bumping this one last time - beta window ends Jan 2nd. I was prepared that there might be no beta testers and for this course Im completely fine with that (which is why I went with this format), Im happy with the course as it is - but just throwing a final reminder that if anyone wants a chance of affecting the final version, the chance is now. See original post.
Finished Courses - Main: Amedal (fictional), Nine Bridges (real)
Other: Austin, Sheshan, Kauri Cliffs, Le Golf Nat. Updates: Whirlpool, Royal Lytham, Royal St George's, Chicago, Chambers Bay, Munchen Nord E
Working on: 2 fictional courses + a couple things...
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Adelade
Posts: 1346
Joined: August 27th, 2019, 10:24 am

Re: Chambers Bay Update - Beta Available Here

Post by Adelade »

Course finalized and uploaded (Edit: Available here: https://linkscorner.org/courses/course.php?crz=2700).

I already described the course earlier (and all the info is in the Readme), so I'll just say this -

The only changes compared to the Beta (apart from removing "Beta" from the name) are minor improvements to the panorama horizon-line and minor edits to make the elevations of a couple fringe spots more natural.

Remember to consider playing the course from the slightly extended Ladies tees, I recommend them as standard tees for Links. If liking tournament simulation, I recommend Gusty F/Fc (or Windy F/Mc) and pins set to difficult. It is still by far a fair challenge on those.

During my final test round, I realized just how much I like this layout, so this course has now actually become one of my very favourite courses for Links! Not surprised that I ended up liking it, but surprised about how much - truly wonderful and unique course. Thank you so much Sage and Sean Landry for having made it in the first place!

And I figured I'll post the full-size screenshots:

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Finished Courses - Main: Amedal (fictional), Nine Bridges (real)
Other: Austin, Sheshan, Kauri Cliffs, Le Golf Nat. Updates: Whirlpool, Royal Lytham, Royal St George's, Chicago, Chambers Bay, Munchen Nord E
Working on: 2 fictional courses + a couple things...
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